Posted by Andre on July 26, 2000 at 21:27:09:
In Reply to: sizing posted by Frank A on July 26, 2000 at 18:19:44:
: Does sizing a pellet help or hurt your
performance? Is it worth the time and effort????
I've asked myself that same question many times! I've tried testing different pellet sizes, both factory and re-sized. I've come to no conclusion: All pellets I've tested, and some are not considered high quality, such as Daisy Quick Silver, group about the same.
I've got a feeling that pellet diamenter is more of a psychological than an actual physical factor in air pistol shooting. I'm not sure that's true for air rifle, since the rifle's precision requirements are much stricter.
Posted by JP O'Connor on July 28, 2000 at 12:01:36:
Per Dan Durben's article (referenced by Scott's posting below) when we test pellets, we are NOT testing sizes. We just think we are! Rather, we are testing a particular combination of 1) gun, 2) gun velocity setting, and 3) pellet lot number. (One can correctly argue that there are a number of other variables as well; but these three are the biggest ones.)
A particular lot that shoots well in your gun may be 4.50 for example, but the next batches of lot numbers you test have no 4.50 pellet lot numbers working well but a particular lot number of size 4.48 happens to be perfect!
The makers don't especially try to make different sizes, rather they measure their production lots for quality control so that the pellets in your tin are consistent. (There's that word again! )
Speaking of consistency, Daisy pellets, and all the variables (not just the three listed above), an Albanian pistol shooter who regularly shoots 380/400 plus tested a bunch of different pellets one day from a machine rest. Funny thing - the Daisy pellets she "tested" for fun had the best group! No, she didn't switch!
So, the bottom line is that pellet size is all in the shooter's head! If one is shooting very, very, very well (world class level), then testing to find a lot that works well in our gun can be of value. But if we are going to worry that the group isn't small enough... don't test... our worry will cost us far more points than the group size!
Yes, the air rifle target is tough... if you are shooting 98% or better in air rifle then testing could be of great benefit... but don't expect your scores to jump to 99.5% overnight!
Those of us who enjoy tinkering and who apply scientific methods to our game sometimes overemphasize the technical. Get a bunch of pellets you trust and just shoot the darn things... a ton of them. Good quality repetitions are important. Remember, that 9.9 you just shot wasn't the pellet! Learn from the mistakes and move on... you will soon whip the shooter whose pellets group tighter than yours but who still worries that their group isn't good enough.
Posted by Jef on July 30, 2000 at 14:11:37:
Get a bunch of pellets you trust and just shoot the darn things... a ton of them. Good quality repetitions are important. Remember, that 9.9 you just shot wasn't the pellet! Learn from the mistakes and move on... you will soon whip the shooter whose pellets group tighter than yours but who still worries that their group isn't good enough.
This is why I like this guy!!
I need to hear clearly stated things like this.
Scott, prepare for another order of Vogels pal.
Posted by Roy Nagel on August 15, 2000 at 02:18:48:
Gotta jump into this one. . . Yes, test those pellets, tweak velocity settings, play with sizing. . .whatever it takes to get the tightest group with whatever brand -- and then you've cleared one of the nastier hurdles to good shooting -- confidence in your equipment/ammunition.
I'll take batches/settings/sizing that produce one-holers over mediocre "1.5x diameter" group-producers every time, for the obvious reason -- my sights can wander slightly and I KNOW my slight inaccuracies won't be compounded by a loose-shooting pellet that plunks into the target just a hair to the down side of the scoring ring, for an 8 instead of 9.
Posted by Gene Rotsch on July 26, 2000 at 18:56:13:
: Does sizing a pellet help or hurt your
performance? Is it worth the time and effort????
Most of the higher quality pellet makers offer usually 4 different sizes on their pellets. 4.48, 4.49, 5.00, and 5.01mm, if I'm not mistaken. This is where your time and effort comes into play, doing Ransom rest testing with your pistol. You work to find the pellet size that your pistol likes the best and gives the smallest group. By using a sizing die, you may be changing the pellet to a size that yields a larger group rather than a smaller one. I think that Neil Johnson offers pellet testing for a small fee. Or if you can get the use of a Ransom rest, you can do it yourself. When you find the pellet that gives the best results, record the size and lot number and buy as many tins of that make, size, and lot as you can afford. I'm sure there are differing approaches to the task, so use the technique that makes the most sense to you. When you find the size pellet the works well in your pistol, using the same lot number may be more trouble than its worth. Only you can decide that.
Enjoy the process, it can be a real education.
Posted by pilkguns on July 26, 2000 at 20:11:41:
First, I think Gene meant to say 4.48,4.49,4.50, and 4.51 for sizes, Sizing is not necessary if you are using high quality pellets such as H&N, RWS, or Vogel. They are already made to exact sizes. Sizers a left over from when pellets were not as consistent.
Lot number is more important than size though. Dan Durben just did a great article on pellet testing in the last Quickshots for those that get the USAS newsletter. If you don't you should join USAS. Anyway, Some people have the idea that wahtever size pellet came with their test group, is EXACTLY what they have to have for their gun to shoot best. This is not the case. Normally just about any pellet size/combination will shoot better than 98% of us can hold, so pellet testing is moot. But for those looking for Nth degree of accuracy, checking various pellets and lot#s thoruhg a rest will find one that your barrel likes best. and can get down close to a perfect circle group. Another lot of the same size by the same manufacturer may not shoot as good. AGain, the differenc between shooting good and not good is still less than the ten ring, so it really doesn't matter. AND a group that shot so-so at one velocity, may shoot a perfect group if you change the velocity a little up or down, and the group that before shot great has now opened up. Unless your consistently making the finals at major competitions, I wouldn't worry about.
But for those of you who wan the best , we do offer pellet testing here. We even had the rest set up doing it at the Nationals.
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